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May 24, 2007

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Discussion Topic: Should Deadbeat Dads Lose Hunting, Fishing, ATV Privileges?

For years now, Maine has denied hunting and fishing—as well as motor vehicle—licenses to parents who skip out on their child support payments. Now the state wants to go farther. From an Associated Press story on WMTW.com:

The House of Representatives has endorsed a bill to allow the revocation of snowmobile or all-terrain vehicle registration from a person who has been certified as failing to comply with a child support order.

What do you think?

Comments

JM

Deadbeats (men or women) should lose all privileges; parents need to put first things first and, in my opinion, children come first.

Jason

why not just take them out and have them shot.

Paul

Hurrah, hurrah! I agree(100%) with the State of Maine's proposed actions on deadbeats and JM's posting! It's about time.

Sam

Im not so certain that this bill is such a good idea. In my experiences, the less you involve the government in your personal life, the better off you are. Also, until the inequalities of divorce court are solved(women recieving preferential treatment) then im not sure its such a good idea. Are child support rulings always fair? Is justice always served? I bet you could find many men who have been treated unfairly by the judicial system when it comes to this sort of thing. Do you want a system that is already stacked againts you to control your hunting rights.

John

Bottome Line: Get a job, pay your support! Although I do agree with Sam to a point. Divorce is definitely not a fair thing whereas mostly the women come out on top. That's why the law is a "Dead Beat Dad" law and not "Dead Beat Parent" law.

Angela Pedersen, R.N.

John states "Get a job". You must not be paying child support John. There is a ton of ignorance based on some of the comments here. Paul makes an excellent point.

Seriously, everyone MUST educate themselves on how the child support system works. It is filled with corruption.

States AND Family court systems PROFIT from the creation of a "non-custodial" parent. They do this through federal Title IV-D incentives! This is why fathers (usually)are made less than an EQUAL parent.

Guess who pays for these incentives to strip a child of their right to EQUAL time with BOTH fit parents? Yep, all of us tax payers. Everyone here should be outraged!

Also, the higher the child support order the more the states and family court systems make in profits! This is why so few fathers (usually) get outrageous support orders that are difficult for any man to pay and even if they lose their jobs rarely do they get a reduction!!

It gets even worse. The so called "fair and neutral" child custody evaluations are actually performed by those who are employed by the court systems which profit under Title IV-D! Wonder why they rarely recommend Joint Physical Custody (difference btw. joint legal custody and joint physical custody) Doesn't it seem like a conflict of interest that these people perform the custody evaluations?

Many fathers are oblivious to the fact when they are married that this could happen to them in a nano-second once their spouse files for a divorce.

Dads need to WAKE UP! Terms like "dead beat dads" should outage you!

Learn more about Title IV-D here:

http://daddy.typepad.com/daddyblog/2007/04/robert_r_parker.html

and

http://supportthemovie.com/images/flash/trailerA.html

and

http://www.achildsright.net/html/title_iv-d.html

Please educate others. Government intrusion on our lives is at a max. Everyone here should prevent bills such as this!

Bobby

What a crock. My son was and still in a very nasty divorce. She cheated on him then it was proven that she and her girlfriend (who works for a lawyer) set him up to fail. He has to still pay child support (3 Childern) even though she makes 15k more then him. She ran up high bills got more credit cards she hit him with the divorce .She clamed that he hit her and caused brusing. She got a order of protection against him for 18mo. He trird to tell his side but it fell on dead ears. We had a bear hunting trip planned in Maine .He couldn't go and because of that order. Two years later she and her girlfriend told others she set him up good little did she know her then one of 5 boyfriend's knew a friend of ours and told our son. Son went to court with this information. He saw the Judge and got all parties together ,he still has to pay . Lawyers now trying to have them as well as her parents charged with lying under oath. Grandchildern don't care much for mom or other grandparents for what they did to there dad. Maybe just maybe ??? Will let you know.

Sam

Thanks Angela but my name is Sam not Paul ;)

Walt smith

I don't think any one should be labled until you know the situation. I am divorced and pay child support. If someone dosen't pay support maybe they have a good reason, maybe they don't. To throw them into a catigory is a neat and simple way that goverment deals with problems so they don't spend time and money getting to know a situation. Personaly I feel that if a person receives child support they should have to present the court and their spouse with an itemized list with reciepts each month on where that money was spent.I also think that at the very least one half of it should be directly on the children instead of rent,utilitys,cellphones,etc. I think there are more mothers that abuse the system than you could possibly imagine. I know for a fact that my ex. does but all I can do is pay my payment and hope that she chokes on a grisly chunk of steak and s.m.i.l.e. I don't think this bill is smart or fair. maybe there should be a simular one for corrupt gov. officals, put that one through and then i'd vote for it. Hey Bobby, your son's case sounds like mine. Just grin and bear it because god will get them all in the end.

Paul

I couldn't agree more that there are abuses of child support by women. My brother's ex- wife is a perfect case study. But, and this is a BIG BUTT. There are abuses on both sides of this story. I see men running around bitching about their children receiving support, all the while their buying toy after toy! All the finest sporting goods and mechanized machines money can buy. BO WHO WHO. It comes to a matter of priorities, children vs. toys. Suck it up and pay big boy, you had the fun between the sheets, not the public. A lot of these guys had a hard time compromising with the other half. They don't have to anymore,they're divorced now. Too bad for the kids,because they're the ones that ALWAYS suffer! The previous postings on a vast government consipracy as a money maker is a bunch of bulls**t! It's like ever other case in this world, try to shift the blame. This bill is a great way to get the DEADBEATS to pay. I hope other states enact similar legislation.Bottom line, "You've got to pay to play"!

Don

It's interesting how you feel for your brother in one line but then slam everyone else with the rest of your post. Most men aren't upset about child support, but how it is ACTUALLY USED. It should be for the children not for moms car pymt.,should be for childrens clothing and school needs,sports equipment and food they like. Not for mommys new wardrobe. If dads buy new toys like you state then maybe they do it for their kids to enjoy, did you ever think of that? Bottom line: you don't know what you're talking about and you've never experienced it.HUSH UP

Paul

Don,
Did you bother to read what the discussion topic was about?? Thus, what I was commenting on. It is about a Maine bill to get DEADBEATS to live up to their responsibilities as parents to their children. NOT about people ACTUALLY paying child support! My family has experienced the abuse that you and others on this blog are so eloquently bitching about. LOL! That doesn't mean I have to personally experience it in order to understand. You maybe that thick in the head, but I'm not. Two things in your posting help me better understand your mindset, First is the comment about mom's car payment. Just how pray-tell is mom to get the little ones to school, appointments, and grocery shopping for the "food they like", if she doesn't own a car? Strapped them to her back? Let me guess, it's alright if Dad own's a brand spanking new 2007 Dodge Power Ram, but mom should run the kids around in an old,unsafe 96 Rattletrap. Now I get where you are coming from?? The other is, the comment about Dad buying toys for HIMSELF,but for the "benefit to the kids". What a bunch of mealy mouth tripe. I WAS born at night,just not last night. I bet when Dad was making the decision to buy his toys, the first and foremost thought in his mind was the kids,not him and his new girlfriend? I've found that the closer one gets to the truth, the people that feel threatened by it, are quick to tell them to shut up.

gamblinp

Like Paul said, let's get the board back on topic. Any father who is actually paying his child support regularly won't have to worry about the consequences of this new law (if it becomes a law). It will only apply to those who DON'T pay.

That being said, I see BOTH sides of the issue. SOMETHING needs to be done about Dads (or Moms, whoever is paying) who REFUSE to pay. I understand there are some non-custodial parents who maybe CANNOT pay ALL of their required payment because of high payment amounts set by a judge who didn't consider the person's income before making his/her final ruling, and I think there should be some kind of review in those cases.
But those who simply refuse to pay and keep moving or whatever so the custodial parent cannot find them; they deserve to have EVERY legal priviledge (driving, hunting, fishing, or whatever) taken away until they can set up a regular payment plan that is verified by the court.

(side response in regards to how "mom" uses the child support: as a man married to a woman receiving child support for her son, I know first-hand that sometimes the child support has to go for groceries, gas for the car, a portion of the house payment, utilities, etc. The child lives in the home, so we have to keep a roof over his head; the child has to eat, so we have to buy groceries; the child has to get to school, soccer practice, etc., so we have to buy gas for the car; he watches TV and plays video games, so he uses electricity; he takes baths and flushes the toilet, so he uses water; and so on. There are certain expenses that go into raising a child that just CANNOT be separated from other expenses simply due to the type of expense it is. If you don't understand that, let me put it this way...does the electric company separate your bill by how much YOU use and how much your children use, or do they send only ONE bill for the usage of the entire household? Unless you have 2 separate meters and 2 separate lines, you normally only get one bill.)

Arnie

Here we go again! More goverment involment! I went through a divorce and was given my kids by the court. She was suppose to pay $100 per month child support, not! Owed over $5000 by the time the kids were old enough to leave. Not once did she lose anything for non support. Had that been reversed I'd been jail and still owed the money and now loose all my rights that I love. Bad enough that the Division of Wildlife has to have my S.S.N. to buy my license. Enough is enough. Lets send these deadbeat politicians a message!

RTD

Aside from the entire fairness issue surrounding child support, I disagree that it's actually government involvement. Technically, the government is simply saying it will NOT allow a ~priviledge~ if this responsibility (and it can be argued it's pretty much THE responsibility) is not being met. I think this makes more sense that some other things such as government suspending professional licenses for non-payment, thus making it that much more difficult for the person to pay the support....!

chuck

i have been a family court referee for 11 years and i've seen every kind of divorce case you can imagine. i think that sanctions need to be immposed for deadbeat parents (not just dads), and this is one that would probably work. i live and work in the upper peninsula of michigan, and i can tell you that taking away someone's hunting and fishing license would be very effective. there are a lot of people who work for cash, don't report their income, move from job to job, all to avoid paying their obligation. they don't have any problem making babies, but they sure have a problem paying their fair share. deadbeats should pay, and they shouldn't be able to hunt and fish if they can't pay their child support. end of story.

Wade

We know the law is not for the man in child support, like pay your Child support and when your finished paying and they don't get any more money from her, then you have to send them to college and she don't help them or you. No, I don't think that its such a good idea, the only ones that's making comments, like take them out and shoot them, has not got a glue of what really happens. Like one person said, it shouldn't be deadbeat dad, but deadbeat Person. Also I raised another mans childern and my own.

Wade

I agree 100% with Chuck and Sam, wake up people. From the state of louisiana.

Nicole

Why not simply turn Maine into a slave state? Oh wait, it already is!
Children come first, ha. What a joke that is. It's the mother who wants a free ride in life. Did the mother think about her ability to financially support her child before deciding to bring that child into the world? My brother's daughter was told by her mother that she didn't "need" all the money she had saved up. So she took it so she could chase her new boyfriend (her 6th since her child was 2, she's now 7) around while he played at various "gigs" around Maine. Child support is an artificial, arbitrarily imposed "debt". Next time you judge "deadbeat dads" ask yourself, when was the last time you were deprived of your license to drive, work, hunt, fish, etc. and threatened with jail time for falling behind on your mortgage, car, credit card payments? Should people who willfully get themselves into so much financial debt that they have to declare bankruptcy lose their license? Why not? At least these are legitimate debts the debtor agreed to pay. Fathers have no reproductive rights whatsoever. He's punished for the very same thing the mother is rewarded for. How's this for responsibility? If you cannot financially support a child, don't get pregnant! There are far many more deadbeat moms than there are deadbeat dads. States have no business getting involved in the family matters such as the CHOICE to have and bear children. If this appalling "law" was directed at women in the majority, you can bet your custody ridden dollar it would have been repealed by now.




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