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October 17, 2007

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Meet The R-15

And what, pray tell, is an R-15? Why bless your universally legal 5-round magazine, it's a black rifle made by Remington, except that it's not finished in black, but finished Advantage Max-1 HD camo. This all came about because a few months back, Remington was purchased by Cerberus, a management company that also owns Bushmaster, which is a leading producer of black rifles that are black.


Taking advantage of Bushmaster's technology, Remington has come out with three R-15s: the Predator, which has a 22-inch fluted barrel, the Predator Carbine, with an 18-inch fluted barrel, and the Predator Carbine CS, with an 18-inch barrel and a telescoping stock. While the guns are marked as Remingtons made in Ilion, New York, and many of their parts are proprietary, they are all compatible with the neat goodies that can be hung on black rifles: triggers, grips, rails, you name it.

Right now they intended for varmint hunters, and so all three are chambered in .223 and .204, with the chance of the 6.8mm being added down the road. I had the chance to shoot a couple, and they worked flawlessly. The trigger, which is Remington's own design, is quite good, and only the very fussy will want to opt for an optional two-stage trigger.

The MSRP for all three is $1,145. Remington.com

Predator Rifle (click image to enlarge)
Rifle

Predator Carbine (click image to enlarge)
Carbine

Predator Carbine CS (click image to enlarge)
Carbinecs

(And a footnote: Popularity of the .223 seems to have gone into the stratosphere. The Remington ammo guys told me that production of .223 ammo has quadrupled over the past 4 years, and that of every three rounds of centerfire ammo they produce, one is a .223. And very little of that is going to the military. Someone is shooting all them black guns.)


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Comments

Walt Smith

Clay-- there was a recent article in the other magazine about a company called Cobb manufacturing that is making them in 270 and 30-06 but I couldn't find a web site for that company. Maybe Dave can come up with that info.

JA Demko

For some reason, I think an AR-10 in .300 Savage would be an absolute hoot as a deer rifle. The cartridge is similar enough to the .308 that it should require nothing more than a new barrel.

Yes, I know that it would do nothing that the AR-10 in .308 wouldn't do at least as well; but this a fun gin I'm talking about.

alabamahunter

A 223 isn't a very capable caliber even on the deer down here unless it is in the hands of a good shot. I've seen two deer shot with the 223, one dropped where it stood and the other was never found(although that can happen with any caliber if it is not a good shot). I've never had the pleasure to shoot a "black gun" but would love to if I got the oppurtunity. I still don't think I would hunt with one. I would like to know what kind of groups the R-15 shoots. For a varmint gun it should be under 1 1/2 inches.

Dave in St Pete

Walt Smith,

Can they make an AR with a long (30-06 / 270) action? I honestly don't know but I do agree with your sentiments. Need a real cartridge in it!

Walt Smith

Dave in St Pete--- The august issue of outdoorlife has a article by Michael Bane titled "the worlds most versatile rifle" on page 63 he states "I recently talked to the guys at Cobb Manufacturing ,who are building spectacular AR-platform guns in .30-06 and other long cartridges like the .270 and 8mm." I realize what Clay is saying about the AR's being a short action but according to this article that company "which I can't find a web site for,HELP!!" is somehow making them and my intrest is peaked.

I know these guns are popular but I wish they wouldn't allow them @ the range I'm a member of. I've seen guys with 30 round clips just blast away @ anything just to empty a clip. They think it's funny and don't give a crap about the image it portrays or the damage it does.

To me, these guns illustrate the excess and selfisness that permeates today's society.


Dave in St Pete

Waly Smith,

I'll ask Micheal Bane if he knows how to contact them (Cobb).

Dave in St Pete

Sorry! Waly = Walt

Black Rifle Addict

To No Name blogger:
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar..stop trying to place us gun owners on a guilt trip for society's problems.
This is the wrong place to blast away at our gun rights, for it's not the type of action that kills but the bullet! Just ask any gun grabber how they feel about it.
I like the camo design, too, and if that helps accept the AR type rifle's image better then so be it.

SilverArrow

Gotta have one! .243 would be nice though!
I had looked at the Bushmaster's a while back; pre first Klintonista Regime if memory serves, but with the ban coming on I decided against buying one in New Jersey. Hopefully Remington scale mass production will not kill the quality Bushmaster is known for!
Guess I start saving my spare change!
SA

SilverArrow

No Name:
I am sure you can find a range that does not allow 'Assault Rifles' so you can plink away with your Daisy Red Rider without pangs of jealousy distroying your karma!
Any of the ranges and clubs I know of here place safety as the Number 1 priority, none ban semiauto weapons but many do not allow full auto. Any shooter who is just blasting away will be quickly admonished and if it continues banned from the facility. That doesn't mean we can't have fun though so if you come bring an open mind and plenty of ammo!
SA

no name, one of the best things about the gun range I go to is that they do allow full auto fire. There's even an old man who brings a .50 caliber machine gun that sits on a tripod. My kids and everyone at the range love it. Excess to me is not an old man shooting a gun, it's seven dollar cups of coffee or someone batting .200 and driving a Lamborghini that you and I couldn't pay the insurance on. Oh and kids in the projects on food stamps wearing $200 shoes.

Bubba

No Name

Kinda long story, will try to be brief.
Went to a range, I was the only one there. Ford, 1-ton, single axle, 4WD, four door - white w/camo accent pulls up. Three GI-Joe types jump out and begin hauling guncases of all types out of truck bed to range tables. I'm wondering, "What's all this?!".
One of 'em approaches me, intro's himself clutching two notebooks the size of S&R catalogues! I tell 'im, "I'm trying out this little Ruger mini 23 then I'm outta here." They're loading clips, I empty my 1 clip and load up to leave. One of the guys steps out onto the grass at the range with a Browning HP with about a foot of clip hanging out the bottom of it, pulls the trigger and I hear, "BRRRRT!!" IT'S FULL AUTO!!!!! I'm standing there amazed and am once again approached by fellow who intro'd himself. He shows me notebooks, it's FFL's on this 1-ton truck load of powder burners they just spent 20 minutes unloading! I'm invited to join, I thank them, take a gander at some of the goodies, and take my leave! They were nice guys! Just not my type of guns! Don't think they had anything with wood on it!

Bubba

Bubba

No Name

Everybody's gotta have a place to shoot!!

Bubba

Dr. Ralph

That last one was me. I'm still pissed at no name though... the image of someone blasting away with a semi-auto or even full auto rifle to me must not be the same as it is to you. I see it as a sign of freedom, a sign of equality because even the peasants like me are allowed weapons. Perhaps emptying thirty rounds at nothing even serves as a warning to a government that is supposed to be of, by, and for the people...

Nate

Is this the article that Walt was looking for?
http://outdoorlife.com/article.jsp?ID=21010945&typeID=700&categoryID=0

WA Mtnhunter

If memory serves me, the AR-10 is not the weapon adopted by our military in .308, or any other caliber. Plenty of myth and urban legend out there. Perhaps I have absorbed some, as well.

All I can personally attest to is that the Army did not issue any Stoner AR-10 rifles between 1969 and 1977. The R&D guys always have some obscure variation of anything possible. Seven years carrying one, two of those in combat, qualifies me as a frequent flier, not the pilot!

Cheers

Dr. Ralph,

I think you may have changed some minds today with your words.

It's amazing how people can forget that issues always have two sides and forums like these help to foster good debate.

Gary S

Please, not all .223 ammo is shot in "Black Rifles" It works great in bolt and single guns also. I just bought a single bbl. in .204 Ruger and will order an extra BBL. in .223. I believe the .204 is flatter shooting but not as popular as the.223. I like to stick close to military size ammo as it is usually easy to purchase,ie. .223, .308, and 9mm.

Gary S

Hey Guys, shoot what you like, be it ""Black or Brown", Just shoot ... Ilove the M-16, AR-15, SKS, even like the M-60, Wouldn't want to carry it all day. Been there, done that. I don't see what the big deal is, if you feel good with a "black " Rifle then shoot it, I like single shots myself, LOVE my Rem 700in .308

Gary S

to: Dave in St. Pete. Dave the longer cartridges work in semi auto's but short cartridges like the .308 work better with the same effect.

Trigger Happy

No Name:

"To me, these guns illustrate the excess and selfisness that permeates today's society."

Are you kidding me? These guns? WTF? To me, you illustrate the double standard that shouldn't exist in the society of gun owners. Are you better than everyone else since you just fire one shot at a time from a bolt action .22? I think not. I have black rifles and back when .223 was much cheaper I did the same "blasting away" because it's fun. Now I do it with my 10/22! I don't know a single gun owner that hasn't at some time in their life emptied a magazine as quickly as possible whether it be from a Ruger Mk II or a 100 round drum. It's like having a Corvette and not mashing the gas on occasion to see what she'll do...... welcome to America.

PDKMF

I personally own a couple of Armalite AR-15 flat-tops. One with a 16" barrel and red dot, the other with a 20" barrel and scope. Love 'em both! But I'd REALLY like to own one in 30-06. I'd like to see how it performs compared to my M1. Also a 6.5-284 if it would work in the magazine. An on and on and on....:) As far as full autos go- it's the person behind the gun who causes the damage or gives the impression, not the gun. Always has been, always will be. There are no bad guns, just bad folks.

David

Hello Ralph the Rifleman,
Take the AR-15 in 450
Read about the new load in NRA Hunter mag November 2007

Dave in St Pete

Walt,

Here is the answer from the "horses mouth".

Yep...the giant Cerberus Capital Management, who own Remington and Bushmaster, bought them, and I expect the Cobb product to be integrated into other lines. The Cobbs are the best long-cartridge AR guns out there — Cobb founder Skip Patel is a genius and an altogether nice guy.

Michael B




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