The 284 Winchester is not really a bad cartridge. It’s a 7mm bullet, 120 grain @ 3200, 139 grain @3100, 154 @2900 and a 175 @2700fps. Would I use it for Elk? You bet! For a lever or auto, it’s a great choice actually. Perhaps if they renamed it the 7mm Winchester or 280 Winchester? Saying 284, it’s a bet of a mouth full to say compared to 280.

Would ya'll recomend a .284 because ive thought about buying one but i want to check if its a gun that will hold up for me real well.

Dave, such hatred for the Win model 88 a classic deer gun! What a fine gun it is despite its weight, poor trigger, and Rube Goldberg action!

Blue Ox

you'll probably find yourself so utterly lost in that steaming pile of illogic that even Coop might not be able to rescue you?

That’s no joke!

PT Barnum didn’t actually say it but it’s still true.

The .284 (and Models 88 and 100) are examples of a company trying to do no more than fan the flames of sales. Everyone company Harley-Davidson to Apple to Ford to Callaway puts some more lipstick on the pig and launches a warmed-over product like it’s the answer to some burning consumer question.

Even thought there hasn’t been a rifle cartridge launched in decades that has filled any meaningful gap, gun and ammunition manufacturers will continue to do this as long as they can separate customers from their money.

Dave,

With respect, I think you left out the ending.

"...and then Winchester killed the .284 for good by introducing the WSM case, which took out a big chunk of the wildcat demand for the round."

Now, maybe we can begin the discussion of the 6.5 and .350 Remington Magnums, the first "short magnums" in history. In spite of the many missteps that Remington took with these two rounds which meant they would never ever sell well or even be fondly remembered by many (which Remington further compounded by totally botching the SAUM line), the 6.5 and .350 have some devout followers.

Colonel Jeff Cooper, who believed there was no real use for the .280 Rem., 8mm Rem. Mag. and even the sainted .338 Win. Mag (I have the G&A magazine issue to prove he wrote this), believed the 6.5 and .350 were real innovations (yes, I also have the G&A mag where he wrote something to that effect). The late colonel even felt confident to use the .350 on anything short of elephant. It was his favorite lion cartridge.

Remington so totally screwed these short magnums even an influential guru cannot rescue them.

If Remington were to issue the .350 in a left-handed Model Seven, ... I'll stop there before I say something obscene.

Steven C wrote:

Even thought there hasn’t been a rifle cartridge launched in decades that has filled any meaningful gap, gun and ammunition manufacturers will continue to do this as long as they can separate customers from their money.

Field and Stream - sign this guy up. It would be nice to hear from a guy on a monthly basis that doesn't believe the latest widget is the savior of shooting or hunting and that your life isn't complete without going into debt up to your eyeballs for 150 fps more.

Jim

This is actually a good topic for a future blog:

Opinions on the last cartridge that was introduced which filled a legitimate gap in hunting performance.

...or...

Which gap still exists?

With all the .270 Win vs. 7mm Rem Mag vs. .280 Rem debates over the years, one can only surmise that it is to keep the gun scribes gainfully occupied and off the welfare rolls. Not to mention keeping the ammunition plants busy separating us from our cash. The same ballistic characteristics are continually repackaged in short fat, super short, super short ultra something or others all the time.

No one will ever convince me that seven thousanths of an inch makes any real difference in the effectiveness of a bullet. Some cartridge names are just plain "cool", or whatever. Some are doomed from the start.

What's that Coop says? "It's the arrow, ..."

I bought a 284 bolt action from Herter's in the good old days and it shot like a dream. It had the Herter's name but looked like it was made in England [BSA ?] I can only say that I wish I had it now.

Call 'em. I just did.

Is this the hub-bub Joaquin Jackson started?

1-800-672-3888 hit 6 on the options, then wait and they'll transfer you to an operator who will in turn transfer you (when you tell her you have a message for the BoD) to an assistant to the Board of Directors. Or I guess you could leave a message on Pres. Sigler's mailbox by spelling out his name after you hit option 6. Whatever.

I told them I watched the original '05 videotaped interview between JJ and the journalist, and read JJ's/the NRA's explanation. I informed them the "clarification" was insulting and unacceptable, mainly because it was painfully obvious JJ was speaking of "AWs", not NFA firearms, and that if JJ was not forced off the board within the very near future (I'll give 'em a few days) I would, very regretfully, resign my membership.

The assistant was polite, and said at one point "so, you read the clarification?" He didn't seem surprised that I wasn't buying it, and promised to forward my comments to the BoD.

We shall see.

Now, I wonder what Dave has against the Winchester Models 88 and 100? I know about the 100's firing pin problem. I bought a Model 100 at a gun show a couple of years ago, and I installed the new firing pin myself. I had always wanted one of these rifles, because I thought they were well-designed and would make an excellent woods rifle. Mine is in .308, and has never failed to feed or fire. Winchester's ads of the time touted the fact that the stock was one piece, and that made the rifle inherently more accurate than rifles like Remington's 742. The Model 88 was supposed to be exceptionally accurate. Both rifles had beautiful lines. Both were, of course, cheapened after 1964. I'm more of a bolt-action rifle fancier, but the Model 100 just attracted me. I've read the opinions of Model 100 owners in various forums, and the opinions are generally very favorable. I'd actually like to see Winchester bring these rifles back. The present Winchester autoloading rifle has the gas piston sticking out of the forend, and is just plain ugly. I think there's a place for autoloaders in the woods, but right now the Browning BAR is the only new one I'd buy.

I have a 308 made by Interarms of Virginia. I've never shot it but it is a bolt with a 24 inch bull barrel. I've finally decided to try to turn this into my greenfield gun. Does anyone have any experience with Interarms? It seems like it should be a very accurate gun. The bolt is of the mauser variety.